Gamal Essam El-Din speaks with , programme director of Human Rights Watch, on the organisation's role in Egypt and the Middle East With no end in sight to the Lebanese-Israeli war, HRW has been criticised for its mild condemnation of Israeli attacks against civilian targets in Lebanon. How do you respond? This is entirely unfounded. HRW strongly condemned Israel's indiscriminate use of weapons. HRW was the first to alert the attention of the world to Israel's use of artillery-fired cluster munitions in populated areas of Lebanon -- the village of Blida -- in violation of international law. HRW also sent three letters, to the US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and to the Syrian and Iranian presidents. HRW urged Rice to ensure that US-supplied weapons are not used in Israeli attacks that violate international humanitarian law. We also communicated our concerns to the Syrian and Iranian leaders, urging them to use their influence to persuade Hizbullah not to resort to rocket attacks against civilian-populated areas in Israel, including the major city of Haifa, as well as pointing out that Hizbullah's use of Israeli soldiers as hostages is a war crime. So we strongly condemned both sides and exercised our role in exposing the dangers of this war on humanitarian life. In spite of your role in defending human rights in the Middle East there are still many who question your motives. HRW's detractors say you are part of US President George Bush's agenda in the Middle East? HRW is a US-based organisation but is by no means part of the US agenda. We frequently call upon the US to support human rights in its foreign policy and we also report on human rights abuses inside the United States itself, such as the Guantanamo Bay prison, police abuse, the detention of immigrants and the death penalty. We want to make sure that the US is not just preaching about respect of human rights but also sets a good example on this issue. We made remarkable reports about US government abuse of human rights in the recent period, eg the transfer of Middle Eastern prisoners from the US to their countries to face torture there. We also exposed the role some EU countries played in transferring these prisoners and offering the US detention facilities and secret prisons in Central Europe. But the US Administration calls for democratisation and respect of human rights in the Middle East, which is what you do... HRW is an independent organisation that was established 28 years ago to monitor the compliance of all countries with international conventions on human rights. We are not exclusively concerned with the Middle East. We make reports that help embarrass abusive governments in the eyes of their citizens all over the world. The Bush administration made its calls for democratisation in the Middle East only after 11 September and in the context of its war on terror campaign. Our calls, by contrast, are old and not just confined to the Middle East. In recent years you have become very active in the Arab world, and in particular in Egypt. How do you explain this? The Arab world is a region in which people suffer from rampant human rights violations and a severe lack of democratisation. To us Egypt is the most important Arab country. The political and cultural role of this ancient country is felt not only in the Arab world, but also across the Middle East, Africa and the Muslim world. We believe greater respect for human rights and democratic life in Egypt will have a positive impact on the entire region. Egypt has been witnessing a steady growth of the role of civil society organisations for more than a year and a half. Due to these developments, HRW decided to set up an advocacy office in Cairo. This office serves not only Egypt but the entire Arab world. Through this office we coordinate with local human rights organisations, journalists, judges, lawyers and political activists. We have conducted a variety of factual reports about violations of the human rights of political activists, journalists and judges. Our reports help a lot in embarrassing the Egyptian government and bring it under huge pressure to stop these violations. And because Egypt is a close ally of the US, HRW was also keen to raise human rights violations there with White House officials and members of Congress to convince them to change the attitudes of the Egyptian government. We have also sent letters to President Hosni Mubarak, urging him to play a role in guaranteeing respect of human rights, free speech and the independence of judges in Egypt. But how has the Egyptian government reacted to your criticism of its practices? In general, when we aim to cover a certain country we try to knock on the right doors. In other words, we insist on approaching the government and ask for permission to operate. Some closed regimes such as North Korea, Syria, Burma, Turkemnistan, Zimbabwe, Sudan and Somalia refuse to allow HRW to work there. But when we see severe abuses in any of these countries, such as is the case with Darfur in Sudan, HRW opts to send secret envoys to monitor conditions. The Egyptian government shows a lot of tolerance for our performance in Egypt. It permitted the creation of a HRW advocacy office in Cairo, though it always directs harsh criticism at HRW reports and on more than one occasion has tried its best to tarnish our image. Besides, the government-owned press always alleges that HRW is advancing an American -- or rather Western -- agenda. Criticism directed at your organisation in this respect alleges that you serve a liberal -- or rather anti-Islamic -- Western agenda. They cite your criticism of the police arrest some years ago of a number of homosexuals. We defend homosexuals not because they are homosexuals but because they are human beings. We do not believe these people should be tortured because of their sexual attitudes. This is not a liberal or anti-Islamic agenda but rather one based on defending the Geneva Conventions on human rights. How do your ensure credibility for your reports? HRW is proud of the even-handedness and accuracy of its reporting. To maintain our independence we do not accept any government financial support. We verify facts and make a legal review of them. This is clear in the reports we made about Egypt, eg about police abuse of the human rights of citizens in Sinai after the Taba terrorist act of October 2004.
